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Deer season coming-up...that reminds me Options
skruzich
#61 Posted : Wednesday, November 05, 2003 3:08:34 PM
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The rules are that you can take 12 deer this year, plus one extra with a special permit. You can take 1 buck with 4 points or more on the side with the least amount of points. They don''t count the brow tines. The rest must be antlerless deer.
They are trying to cull the herd so that the habitat can sustain them.
Personally i don''t care about getting a buck like that. I prefer to leave the big bucks alone as they will make excellent stock for future seasons. Also they tend to be tougher than the young deer. And i don''t trophy hunt at all. Never saw any use in doing that.
steve
Garden Lad
#62 Posted : Wednesday, November 05, 2003 7:23:14 PM
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OK, that makes a little more sense. What they''re saying is, "hey, you trophy hunters, here''s how we''re defining it." Everybody else has to shoot antlerless deer.

Using traditional methods, that Georgia trophy would be ten points or more.

Meanwhile, the overabundance of does is being thinned out. If it works (that is, if hunters will harvest them), then it''s fine to leave the small bucks alone, as they won''t get a chance to breed once the herd in back in balance.

Been my experience, hunting through most of the east and a good hunk of the west, that it won''t work. Hunters are still reluctant to shoot does. So eventually it will come down to a culling operation.

Steve, I''m like you. Can care less about a rack (you can''t eat horns!). For me, deer is something that''s hunted for the freezer, not because it''s particularly sporting.
Sheila
#63 Posted : Wednesday, November 05, 2003 7:52:42 PM
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The guy who allegedly started our monstrous Cedar fire here in San Diego County fancied himself a hunter. He got separated from his buddy, it was getting dark, so he started a fire to draw attention to himself. This during a widely publicized "red flag fire hazard" period (no fires allowed anywhere). By the way, when he was rescued, he had food and water with him. Overnight lows in the area were expected to dip to about 60 degrees. Cost: 16 human lives, untold animal lives, over 2000 houses and about 300,000 acres lost.
skruzich
#64 Posted : Wednesday, November 05, 2003 11:00:47 PM
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I agree Gardenlad! Freezer filler ;) Especially when you have a large family and limited income.
Sheila,
I understand your comments on the hunter totally, but you must realize that a person can die in 60 degree temps even with food and water. Your body temp can go down even in that temp range. Hyperthermia is the number one cause of death in hunting accidents when hunters get lost.
Now was this hunter a idiot? You bet! he let that fire get away from him. There are so many ways to burn a fire without the catastrophy that has happened. IT takes common sense.
If i were a resident of that area, i wouldn''t be concerned as much with the actions of this hunter as i would be that the fire could have been stopped before all this devestation happened. The government powers turned back the water planes that could have put the fire out when they were within 5 miles of the fire.
It would have been put out, minimal damage, and no lives lost. Thats the hard questions I would be asking! What a shame so much damage so many lives due to carlessness and burocracy.
steve
Sheila
#65 Posted : Thursday, November 06, 2003 3:58:58 AM
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It''s hard for me to imagine that a clothed, dry person, could die overnight at 60 degrees, but I''m not the outdoorsperson that you are, Steve, so I won''t argue the point.

Under these conditions, and if you''ve never been in a Santa Ana wind , in a field full of 50 year old tinder dry fuel, they''re difficult to imagine, an individual couldn''t expect to keep a fire under control. Think about single digit relative humidity and wind gusts to 40 mph. That''s why they issue the red flag warning.

And yes, I''m aware of the call-off. It was actually a Sheriff''s dept. helicopter. But the US Forestry called him off when he was 5 minutes away. Rules state that he can''t fly for fire suppression later than 30 minutes before sundown. I saw the interview with the pilot on TV. He stated that he thought he could have safely made 3 drops before it got too dark for him to fly. He also clearly looked frustrated.

They''ve now appointed "multi-agency committees" to review the response to the fire. I''m expecting that to cost lots of money and not change a thing. But hopefully I''m pessimistic.

And please note that I said the man "fancied himself a hunter." A true outdoors type would have used better judgment and perhaps been better prepared. Cell phone? GPS? 2 way radios for him and his buddy?

Another thing: Most counties of our size in CA have dedicated firefighting avionics. Our voters keep voting such expenditures down.....
skruzich
#66 Posted : Thursday, November 06, 2003 5:31:39 AM
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Sheila, look i didn''t say he wasn''t a idiot ;) He should share in his responsibility. The disgusting thing is that the "regulations" left the public in a dangerous position concerning the water drop.
Committees do nothing but consume money! I feel for yall.
Now i don''t think a true outdoors type would have all that equipment you mentioned. I never have had such equipment while hunting, never needed it, never wanted it either. For the most part most hunters are responsible people but unfortunately we can''t do a litmus test to determine who is a idiot and who isn''t.

Want to bet the next item on the ballot is to get more equipment for fighting fires?
Oh well. Yall take care and we are glad that your safe!
steve
srj
#67 Posted : Thursday, November 06, 2003 6:14:06 AM
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steve & GL *how antler points are counted is based on geography, not bragging rights..agreed 100% my use of the phrase "8 pointer" was meant to be discriptive & it''s common place here if a buck is taken to say a button , spike or point''s have seen some not symetrical/nontypical racks referred to as you say a 4x3 or ?? still just discriptive..

also a freezer hunter here as well, antlers are just a bonus my boy''s second year out & was the first deer seen and taken clean ,his call ,,is the old man proud you bet but would be just as proud if it was a yearling doe any deer is a trophy

in my house the trophy''s are the smiles on his face & his telling of the story ,,meal''s shared with family & friends/deer camp
now tanning the hide & boiling the skull for mounting ,,been thinking about doing some scrimshaw on the skull for him but i''ve never done it,, any suggestons?

sheila
i have to agree with everything you and steve have posted, he should have been better prepared for a adverse situation ,sorry but i don''t know a fix for stupidity ,always plan for the worst & hope for best jmho.
tc ray

VaughnHill
#68 Posted : Thursday, November 06, 2003 6:36:53 AM
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Some city boy buys a gun, shoots it once, then heads for the woods. He shoots anything that moves, wanders around aimlessly for a few hours. and when it starts to get dark he panics, and finds himself lost.

Please do not insult the rest of us hunters by calling this guy who cault the forest on fire a hunter.
srj
#69 Posted : Thursday, November 06, 2003 6:54:40 AM
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come on now VH why wrong topic??
VaughnHill
#70 Posted : Thursday, November 06, 2003 6:57:25 AM
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there i fixed it
srj
#71 Posted : Thursday, November 06, 2003 7:11:49 AM
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yep ya did & very well said
Garden Lad
#72 Posted : Thursday, November 06, 2003 12:27:50 PM
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>my use of the phrase "8 pointer" was meant to be discriptive
Well of course. All I was pointing out is that such descriptions vary depending on where you live.

And, btw, congrats to your boy on a job well done!
srj
#73 Posted : Thursday, November 06, 2003 5:25:22 PM
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GL i know that ,it''s why i quoted you ,kinda tomato ,tamato, or maters ;)

thanks for the congrats i''ll show him this thread when he gets in
Sheila
#74 Posted : Thursday, November 06, 2003 6:47:45 PM
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Okay, I''ve said it twice now: FANCIED himself a hunter. And regarding the gear, an experienced hunter wouldn''t need the techno stuff...but a neophyte with no idea of the lay of the land or the realities of hunting could have saved us all a lot of tragedy if he''d availed himself.

dropkick
#75 Posted : Friday, November 07, 2003 11:06:22 AM
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Stopped at a gas station one season and saw an out of state truck parked with a nice 4 point (8 or 10 point for you other guys) tied with its'' head up so everyone could see it. I walked over to look at it.
It had been shot at least 12 times. They were going to have a hard time finding any usable meat.
If it had been mine, I would have had it hidden under a tarp.

Worked in a bar one year, and after listening to the idiots telling stories and some of the advise they gave out, I was scared to go into the woods ... I might end up in the same area as them.

There should be a test you need to take before you get your license (the 1st time, or out of state).


I agree with Steve, you can''t eat the antlers.
I have always been a meat hunter.
Garden Lad
#76 Posted : Friday, November 07, 2003 11:18:28 AM
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>There should be a test you need to take before you get your license (the 1st time, or out of state).
I''ve got mixed feelings about that, Dropkick.

On one hand, I understand your reasoning, and agree with it. There are an awful lot of idiots out there whose only concern is going "bang!" and killing something. Basic safety, woodcraft, and marksmanship mean nothing to them.

On the other hand, testing would be just one more governmental incursion into our lives. And I doubt it would do much good. Every state now has a hunter safety course, required before you can get a license. But, in many cases, it just doesn''t stick. The kids go through the course _only_ because the law says so. And then, particularly if their father-uncle-big brother-whowever is a slob hunter, they forget what they learned in class, and emulate their mentor instead.


crwmdpmr
#77 Posted : Wednesday, November 12, 2003 2:59:51 AM
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I grew up in Wisconsin and the main reason
I never learned to hunt was all the peole
from the Chicago area who would buy a gun
and a twelve pack and head up north to shot
something. Alot of the farmers have to spray
orange day-glo dye on the holsteins to keep
them safe.
Garden Lad
#78 Posted : Wednesday, November 12, 2003 3:38:45 AM
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How many of those slobs did you actually ever meet, I wonder?

I spent the ten longest years of my life in northern Illinois, close on to the Wisconsin border. Frankly, I don''t think the area has much to offer anybody---with the possible exception of the size of the deer herd and the size of individual animals. Nobody else can touch Illinois for whitetail deer.

But fair is fair. I heard that argument for a decade, from Wisconsians who needed somebody to blame for their own shortcomings.

The fact is, if you actually look at the statistics for slob hunting in the Badger State most of them are residents. And, as it turns out, they''re not even from the big cities like Milwaukee.

Wisconsin also has one of the most discriminatory licensing fee structure in the country. Very sanctimonious about it, they are, too. "We only want you to pay your fair share of the resource," they say.

Well, there''s fair share and fair share. When I lived in that neck of the woods, for instance, a resident bear tag was $11. Non-resident was $100.50. Seems like I would pay my share and that of ten natives.

Between the discriminatory licensing, and the out and out war waged between the DNR and the Tourism Department, I just didn''t bother much. Instead of 8 miles to the Wisconsin border, I would make the long drive around the horn to fish and hunt in Michigan---where I was made to feel welcome.
crwmdpmr
#79 Posted : Wednesday, November 12, 2003 8:00:33 PM
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Actually, I lived in Wisconsin but I went to private
school in Illinois. Alot of the people in school
who were better off would meet your definition
of "slob hunter." They didn''t even get that many
deer though so then they would take a trip to
one of those farms that let you shoot capitive
animals, which to me is about as low as you can go.

skruzich
#80 Posted : Wednesday, November 12, 2003 10:52:49 PM
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crwmdpmr, the kids that have everything under the sun given to them make the worst hunters. Generally their parents are too busy making a living to spend any time like going hunting or target practicing, and they may have not had it taught to them either. While i will defend their right to have that gun and go hunting, I wouldn''t encourage them or recommend them going and I don''t necessarily believe they should even have a gun.
What would work is making every kid go through a firing range. I was trained by my grandfather and when i was a kid i used to take my rifle to school and target practice in our gun club we had at school. Yeah i took guns to school! What a concept! and NOONE got shot! What another Concept!
If we train our kids in the responsible handling of firearms, then we can stop all the lunacy out there.
Shooting captive animals should be outlawed!
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