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We can see we have created a time bomb... Options
John Edward Mercier
#1 Posted : Monday, October 19, 2009 5:05:53 PM
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Posts: 134,494

So your depopulation suggestion is what?

 

MC
#2 Posted : Friday, November 20, 2009 11:16:18 PM
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Posts: 134,494

I'd say that a great deal of that information leans to the radical left extreme. 

I'd farther say that I most often see that information quoted by people who seem to believe that they, their friends, and people who think like them should be the ones chosen to survive.  Hey-- who needs Bildebergers when you've got a bunch of average self-rigthteous snobs????

But let's assume, for a minute, that it's accurate.  For all I know, it may be.  My depopulation plan is what the depopulation plan has always been:  We'll go about doing what we do, and eventually all our artifice will not be able to stop God or Gaia or Nature or whatever from restoring the balance (or rebalancing the equation).  At that point, either we'll all die or the strongest, the smartest, the most prepared, the most adaptible, and the luckiest will survive. 

That is the way it is.  Is it nice???  No, it is not.  Even absent the evils of our society, the world is not nice.  It also isn't kind, secure, comforting, or particularly just.  It is, however, more fair than any other way of dealing with it I can come up with.

Short of awarding reproductive rights to about 10% on a lottery system...

...awarding instantaneous death to about 30% on the same lottery system...

...and sterilizing the other 60% in short order.

Personally, I'd rather take my chances with being strong, smart, ready, or lucky.  And I don't think I'm any of those things. 

allenwrench
#3 Posted : Friday, November 20, 2009 11:16:18 PM
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Posts: 134,494
Our world is upside down, when the right way to s sustainable future will bring our world down. The only thing to do to keep the Ponzi scheme going is to do just the opposite of prudent advice. What would happen to our economy if we took the advice and did as this reworked 'victory' poster from WW II suggested? [IMG]http://i685.photobucket.com/albums/vv219/keepitlow456/victorygarden.jpg[/IMG]  IT'S NOT THAT SIMPLE TO DO A 180...Without compulsive spending and conspicuous consumption funded by unaffordable debt, we would fail as a country. Since our economy if fueled 70% by the consumer, we must stay in debt and consume by any means necessary to keep the Ponzi scheme from collapsing.  We must make shoddy products that self-destruct quickly - so new products are in constant demand to keep the workforce of drones working. All the while squandering natural resources, but we are increasing the business of the landfills.  We must not grow our own food. We must buy poisonous food from chemical laden farms. Our concrete jungles could never hope to allow anything else from their inhabitants. [IMG]http://i685.photobucket.com/albums/vv219/keepitlow456/DSC02545pot.jpg[/IMG]  Would you rather eat an embalmed potato or a live potato? 'Green Giant' red potato vs home grown KB potato. Both stored for 7 months in my root cellar.  And we must squander fossil fuels as fast as possible to keep the economy booming. What would all the tourists traps from Las Vegas to Florida do without the travelers? And the multitude of business that depend on travel along the pilgrimage routes?  On an a more global level, lets say everyone becomes voluntary simplicity and frugal squirrel devotees. We recycle, reuse, repair and just say NO to buying more crap. If we stop buying all the stuff that America imports from China - who keeps the 1.3 billion plus people in China from starving, so they do not go back to old ways of trying to take over the world?  We can see we have created a time bomb. Even the highest level brainiac economists can't fix what ails us.  Our whole system is based on an unsustainable model that will eventually collapse no matter how much money that is printed up by the Fed. (...they don't even need to print money nowadays, all that needs to be done to create billions is to magnetize a silicon chip!) Tony Benn's take on things: nserZOf1-4&feature=related">http://www.youtube.com/watch?vnserZOf1-4&feature=related Now, let's take a look at how our Ponzi schemed world was built... [IMG]http://i685.photobucket.com/albums/vv219/keepitlow456/popchart.gif[/IMG] We can see the population was pretty steady over the centuries. People lived within natures boundaries. They grew their food, burned wood for fuel and ate the game and fish nature provided...until the age of fossil fuels.  Whale oil or wood was the prevalent fuel up to that time. As whale oil was running out, coal and liquid coal (crude oil) came on board. Then petroleum / natural gas based fertilizers made cheap food possible.  Fossil fuels allowed people to move from an agrarian from of life to an urbanized city lifestyle that removed all the hard and dirty work of growing and producing one's own food. Fossil fusels also made possible many areas of life extending improvements to humans. And people spread to all corners of the planet and flourished...but by an artificial and non sustainable means.  What happens when something is running at an unsustainable pace?  It must slow down to a sustainable pace - if it is to keep moving forward steadily and sustainably.  It would be one thing if we all reverted back to rural living, burning trees for fuel and housing and living within our comfortable means allotted to us by nature, as our ancestors did back in the day. But seven billion people can't burn the trees! When we live out of balance with natures intended means there is a price to pay to come back in balance with nature. And the price usually extracts pain from us in the adjustment process. Now renewable energy will replace some of fossil fuels benefit to mankind. But don't be under the delusion that they are a seamless and fungible replacement. There is NO replacement for crude Even if we did find out how to burn water for energy, petrochemicals make up a large portion of crude's importance to mankind. Roughly 9% of every barrel of crude goes to petrochemical use.  If we stopped burning crude this instant, we would still suck the wells dry, albeit not as quickly, just from petrochemical use.  So even if we all stop driving, we will just be postponing the inevitable depletion of crude oil. A partial list of products made from crude:  Solvents Diesel Motor Oil Bearing Grease Ink Floor Wax Ballpoint Pens Football Cleats Upholstery Sweaters Boats Insecticides Bicycle Tires Sports Car Bodies Nail Polish Fishing lures Dresses Tires Golf Bags Perfumes Cassettes Dishwasher Tool Boxes Shoe Polish Motorcycle Helmet Caulking Petroleum Jelly Transparent Tape CD Player Faucet Washers Antiseptics Clothesline Curtains Food Preservatives Basketballs Soap Vitamin Capsules Antihistamines Purses Shoes Dashboards Cortisone Deodorant Footballs Putty Dyes Panty Hose Refrigerant Percolators Life Jackets Rubbing Alcohol Linings Skis TV Cabinets Shag Rugs Electrician's Tape Tool Racks Car Battery Cases Epoxy Paint Mops Slacks Insect Repellent Oil Filters Umbrellas Yarn Fertilizers Hair Coloring Roofing Toilet Seats Fishing Rods Lipstick Denture Adhesive Linoleum Ice Cube Trays Synthetic Rubber Speakers Plastic Wood Electric Blankets Glycerin Tennis Rackets Rubber Cement Fishing Boots Dice Nylon Rope Candles Trash Bags House Paint Water Pipes Hand Lotion Roller Skates Surf Boards Shampoo Wheels Paint Rollers Shower Curtains Guitar Strings Luggage Aspirin Safety Glasses Antifreeze Football Helmets Awnings Eyeglasses Clothes Toothbrushes Ice Chests Footballs Combs CD's Paint Brushes Detergents Vaporizers Balloons Sun Glasses Tents Heart Valves Crayons Parachutes Telephones Enamel Pillows Dishes Cameras Anesthetics Artificial Turf Artificial limbs Bandages Dentures Model Cars Folding Doors Hair Curlers Cold cream Movie film Soft Contact lenses Drinking Cups Fan Belts Car Enamel Shaving Cream Ammonia Refrigerators Golf Balls Toothpaste Gasoline  From this list we can see that we are massively depend on crude for our non sustainable lifestyle.  It has been estimated that for the earth to sustainably support its population without fossil fuels a 90% dieoff must occur. I don't know if that is the right figure, but I do know humans could not live as they do unless it was funded by artificial means via fossil fuels.  http://dieoff.org/ So if this dieoff happens, of course there will be great amounts of pain in the world. But it is natures intended balancing act.  It also reminds us that nature does not bow to humans - it is humans that always bow to nature.  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carrying_capacity
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